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Printed product vs. uploaded image (Read 7713 times)
David_132135
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Printed product vs. uploaded image
Nov 21st, 2007, 5:35pm
 
I have uploaded two card images measuring 5" x 7" @ 300 ppi per your guidelines.  The designs were both accepted.  On my "storefront" I can clearly see the borders I included in the image.  However, when I received the printed product, the border is missing from the top, severely cut on the right side, somewhat reduced on the bottom - and the left border is on the rear of the card after the fold.  (I have temporarily made the cards "private" to avoid any customer dissatisfaction.)  I realize I can eliminate the border to avoid the problem, but why the disparity between what was uploaded/ accepted and the final product?  Thanks for any help.
 
David/designsbydmeeker
http://www.greetingcarduniverse.com/designsbydmeeker
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Shaun_131054
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Re: Printed product vs. uploaded image
Reply #1 - Nov 21st, 2007, 6:58pm
 
Hi David,
When cards are printed by our fulfillment partner, there is a .25 inch machine allowance, meaning that the image may be shifted slightly on the press and when cut, but it will always fall within the allowance.  We highly recommend using our image template when creating images as it makes note of this allowance.
 
The template can be downloaded here:
http://www.greetingcarduniverse.com/images/gcu/GCU_card_templates.zip
 
This .25 inch allowance makes adding borders to an image a little tricky.  If your border is visible within the red dotted-line on our template then it will always appear on the card, however since the card may not always be perfectly centered, theres a chance that thinner borders may look uneven on print.  With a thicker border the inconstancy is hardly noticeable.  
 
You may want to take a look at this forum topic as it contains a good deal of information on adding borders to your cards:
http://www.greetingcarduniverse.com/forum/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1188253865
 
With regard to the back of the card, a few millimeters of the front image will always spill over to the back, this unfortunately is unavoidable.  
 
If you have any additional questions, please let me know.
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David_132135
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Re: Printed product vs. uploaded image
Reply #2 - Nov 22nd, 2007, 11:07am
 
Shaun,  
 
Thanks again for helping me to understand this process.  This is all new to me and your help is very much appreciated.  Thanks for clarifying the border and printing issues for me.  I'll try using the template.
 
David
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Christine_131252
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Re: Printed product vs. uploaded image
Reply #3 - Nov 23rd, 2007, 7:05am
 
Hello,
I, too, have had this problem.  I have downloaded the template and save my images to 2100 x 1500  and 300 resolution.  
 
Shaun, when you stated to make sure your image stays within the red dotted line, do you mean all cards would have a border of white after uploading in order to insure that your full design is printed?
 
Also, why wouldn't there be a "quality control" step when printed?  I would think that poor printing would not bring repeat customers.  It's like when the chef makes sure each and every dinner leaving his kitchen is in perfect order to be served at the table, and it would make good business sense to insure that all cards sent from the printer are 'high quality' printing.  
 
Are poorly printed cards being sent to paying customers irregardless of quality? Artists can only proof the work on the computer screen. Someone should be doing a quality control check on cards being sent to paying customers.  It would help all of us if only quality cards leave the printers.
 
I am envisioning that the printer is high tech and could make sure the downloaded image is placed on the card correctly and includes all the image and not cut off sides and borders.
 
Should cards have a white border around them (ie. all color and image within the red dotted lines)?
Are we losing repeat customers due to poor printing?  If a card prints improperly, there should be steps to correct that card.  We are making a mistake if we are sending out poor product to paying customers.
 
Thanks for your reply.  
 
Chris Q.
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Cara_131386
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Re: Printed product vs. uploaded image
Reply #4 - Nov 23rd, 2007, 11:51am
 
Printing is so important, if we want customers to return.  I would hope that we have quality control to take care of a card that prints badly.  Please tell me that we have steps in place now, that catches a card that might not have printed out correctly and/or neatly.
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Christine_131252
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Re: Printed product vs. uploaded image
Reply #5 - Nov 23rd, 2007, 12:58pm
 
I agree we should have a 'quality control' step on each and every card when leaving the printer.  Customers receiving improperly printed cards will most likely not return to buy more and they probably won't recommend others to shop for cards at GCU.  We can't afford to have 'poorly printed' cards to be sent out as 1st poster remarked:
 
"On my "storefront" I can clearly see the borders I included in the image.  However, when I received the printed product, the border is missing from the top, severely cut on the right side, somewhat reduced on the bottom - and the left border is on the rear of the card after the fold.  (I have temporarily made the cards "private" to avoid any customer dissatisfaction.)"
 
I hope this can be corrected.
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Patricia_131634
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Re: Printed product vs. uploaded image
Reply #6 - Nov 23rd, 2007, 4:19pm
 
I think there is a further question.  
 
I fully understand the live area issue --the space within the red dotted line which marks the .25 trim allowance required by your printing partner.
 
But my question is this: having centered my image and text within this live area, what guarantee do I have that the cut will leave it centered? No matter where the live area is on the face of any card, a card that is cut too far to one side or the other will result in an off-center, poor quality card that I would never let out of my studio if I were printing by hand as I used to.
 
In the 80s I did a lot of color print buying for a large advertising agency, both sheet fed and web. I have never encountered a printer that required a .25" margin outside a live area...that's like having Delaware for a live area surrounded by Texas for the trim margin!
 
I also have a concern that the trim on cards will vary from print run to print run meaning that the correctly printed and cut card that I order for a QC check may be a fluke as the next one printed may be cut badly.
 
What are we to do? Is it just the nature of POD printers and do we just shrug and say "oh well, there are a lot more customers out there?" I've already had a card sent to a customer that had part of the verse missing. I'm sure CGU's customer service is excellent, but if a customer receives a poor quality, or unusable card for an occasion, they can't wait for a replacement. They'll just go to the drugstore or WalMart and forget about ordering from GCU again.
 
This is the age of wonderfully accurate pre-press digital imposition, so I do not understand your printing partner's requirements. How close a connection do you have with them? Are you able to send someone to see a print run so that some problem-solving can be done? GCU is the printer's client..what kind of customer service are they offering you?
 
Thank you for taking the time to read this lengthy posting. This is a vital issue and I look forward to input from other artists. I also thank GCU in advance for giving this topic their close attention and keeping us all informed as to resolutions to the problem.
 
Regards,
Pat
Will Davis Studios
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Ernestine_131365
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Re: Printed product vs. uploaded image
Reply #7 - Nov 23rd, 2007, 9:27pm
 
Just wanted to put in my 2¢ worth in: Shouldn't we have a template that allows for a "bleed?"  When a card's image should go all the way to the edge on ALL sides, it's a little frustrating to have a slash of white on one edge (while part is overrunning to the back).  This hasn't happened all the time, but sometimes.  Wouldn't a template that had the left side (on portrait, top side on landscape) be the CENTER of the full printed card and then allows 1/16" bleed (over the 5x7) on the other 3 sides?  Using a template of this sort has worked well for me with other printers.  
 
I've also tried to keep cards with BORDERS within the 1350x1950 (300DPI) "safe" area, but this doesn't always guarantee a "centered" card.  Are the cards printed on "pre-cut" 10x7 sheets or on larger sheets then trimmed?  I'm imagining that it's pre-cut since we are asked to design to EXACTLY the 5x7 finished size.
 
Now that GCU is getting so big, I hope that quality, consistent printing remains a priority.
 
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Gail_131703
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Re: Printed product vs. uploaded image
Reply #8 - Nov 24th, 2007, 9:44am
 
I've been studying this thread closely, because this is a big concern to me also. I like to use a lot of borders.
 
I have noticed an additional component of this issue, which is that apparently the live area is frequently enlarged slightly. I have noticed this on quite a few of the samples I have ordered.
 
It is very upsetting to think that a large percentage of cards are going out badly printed--not only do you lose that customer, but they are certainly not going to recommend us to their friends.
 
 
 
 
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Christine_131252
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Re: Printed product vs. uploaded image
Reply #9 - Nov 24th, 2007, 1:03pm
 
Is it difficult for the printer to adapt printing to the image?  I am missing something here.  I would think that printer's job is to capture the image within the "printing space" in its entirety.  To restate, image seen on computer is image printed on card.
 
Why can't the printer adjust the image to capture the whole image?  I really don't understand this.  When I print at home, I am able to do that.  Why wouldn't a printing company with much more experience and high quality printers be able to do this?  
 
Another issue:  artist name on back of card would be more professional and give the front of the card a sharper look
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Jehanne_132596
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Re: Printed product vs. uploaded image
Reply #10 - Nov 24th, 2007, 7:36pm
 
I have just read this post as well as the suggested link which. answered something I was thinking about last night - which was "where was the bleed?".  My suggestion to admin is to write the word "bleed" on the card template, as the template instructions are a little confusing since it says to cover the whole card with the image and has no mention (as far as I saw) of the word 1/4" bleed.  So now I need to go back over all my card and double check for the bleed and their proportions  Sad. luckly I only have a couple up  Wink
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Mindy
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Re: Printed product vs. uploaded image
Reply #11 - Nov 25th, 2007, 4:35pm
 
Certainly an important topic and we whole-heartedly agree on the importance of quality.  I will defer to Shaun to reply with more details on some of the specific printing process questions you have.  Here are a few items to keep in mind:
 
Our printing partner is one of the best in the industry and is committed to producing quality products in mass at a reasonable price.  We are in excellent company with other customers of theirs like American Express, Kodak Gallery and the U.S. Postal Service to name a few.  
 
Expectations for quality need to be reasonable.  It’s typically a trade off of quality and price.  With low priced/margin items the extent of quality control has to be balanced with the costs incurred and an acceptable level of variance.  It is not cost effective to have a human physically check each card.  We could not offer cards at $2.49 nor offer you a 50 cent commission.  Costs would be so high we’d have to increase prices and price ourselves out of the market.  
 
In over 4 years of working with this printing partner customer complaints have been few and far between.  Understandably as the artist you inspect your designs with a keener and more critical eye.  We appreciate that.  The customers are not as discerning.  Additionally we offer a 100% money-back satisfaction guarantee.
 
It is a gross overstatement to say that cards are going out “badly printed” or “in poor quality”.  The issues of alignment apply to a small set of designs (where borders are used) and is relatively subtle.   Is there room for improvement?  Certainly.
 
We will continue to work with our printing partner to make improvements where possible and will revisit our card template to make guidelines more clear.  There are many new things we will be able to introduce next year with the help of our printing partner like back image credits, international bulk shipping and more.
 
We appreciate your patience as we make improvements.  We value your desires for the best possible products.  Know that we share the same desires while balancing other elements of the business.    
 
Mindy
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Patricia_131634
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Re: Printed product vs. uploaded image
Reply #12 - Nov 25th, 2007, 5:21pm
 
Thank you for you in-depth response, Mindy.  
 
It is reassuring to hear that you have a considerable track record with your printing partner and that customer complaints are infrequent. I am so new to this whole venue, and still sorting out the "hows' and "whys".
 
I expect that a few other artists here at GCU feel a certain uneasiness at letting go of control over the finished product. I know I do. So thank you for your efforts to help with my jitters as I learn the ropes. Time, experience, and continued joint success (GCU's and mine) will make me increasingly more confident in GCU.
 
Thank you for addressing the card template. I look forward to being able to successfully add borders to some of my designs.
 
Regards,
Pat
Will Davis Studios
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Jehanne_132596
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Re: Printed product vs. uploaded image
Reply #13 - Nov 25th, 2007, 9:05pm
 
Thanks Mindy for your response.
I forgot to ask - What is the final print size of the card?  
Is it 4.5x6.5"?
I just want to make sure I got it right.
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Gail_131703
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Re: Printed product vs. uploaded image
Reply #14 - Nov 26th, 2007, 9:06am
 
Thanks for your response, Mindy--very reassuring. I think it is our high opinion of GCU that is producing unreasonable expectations. Smiley I really didn't understand how printing vagaries could affect the final product. I look forward to some more guidance from Shaun as I rethink some of my designs.
Thanks!
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